Потребительская лояльность в спортивной индустрии на примере Национальной Футбольной Лиги

I: And do you know how the whole lake tailgating thing originated? What it's like all started.

R: I think it's kind of a throwback from the old days because I know the South they tailgate a lot for college football. I'm not exactly sure where it originated, but it's an old like Lambeau Field does is really a Wisconsin thing. I know. Even like in some high school sports, like our high school would have a tailgate for a few big games. Time for people to get together

I: Do you have any specific rituals before attending like a game? Or maybe even before watching a game

R: for the football for the NFL, I always you go to church and then you go straight over keeper home. It hasn't changed like when we're new on this we do the same thing I just have to rush Sasha we gotta get we gotta get ready if we have to get get things from the store. Kind of Hurry up because I want to watch the fox NFL Sunday cuz I just remember as a kid, same guys doing doing the show since I was a kid. They add a few people but it's still the same thing. It just, you know, it seems like normalcy and then the music you know, listening to music Just brings you back. Then now I have added, oh, you know, you got fantasy football and then I started occasionally if there's a game that I feel really passionate about, like I'll do fanduel like for $1 see if I can win 80 cents. Again better Eastern man. Oh, and for baseball we usually because the games could be whenever, like Sunday baseball games are fun because they're usually at one o'clock and then you just wash don't really, really have any baseball rituals, I guess as like before we watch at home.

I: How important is it to you that your children, future children cheer for the same team as you do.

R: I don't really know I guess you know, you kind of expect your kids to mirror like your siblings, your your situation. Like my sisters. I guess it'd become perverse fans and they live in Milwaukee Colleen has become a big Bucs fan because she works for the Bucs. But they don't care about football at all. Like they hate football. And it's becoming more and more obvious. Like they don't care. They don't know any of the rules. My wife knows way more about than they do. They don't care. And they've had this like resentment building up now where it's like, No, no, I want to watch the xfl football more football now. Which is interesting. I don't know why or I just never noticed that as a kid if they weren't watching, but I guess I never care. But yeah, I just put if my They don't. Now. Maybe I'm old fashioned. But if my daughters don't care about football or sports, that's fine. If they're going to, I would prefer if they liked my games. And I'm assuming that my daughters are going to do for some reason, like sports. Because I'll just I'll be something we're gonna be doing.

Yeah. And I mean, I feel like my wife really likes sports you know? Why wouldn't it be like that like? Yeah, exactly. I don't expect them. I don't really want them to be as obsessed over sports as I was when I was in high school. Like I wanted a career in sports. Like, when I knew I couldn't be a professional. I wanted to my set, my fallback was going to be sports management, where I could work for minor league baseball team or event like I thought I should be a journalist, like a sports journalist or something. That's to us too much. I was trying to memorize every single player on the MLB.

But the boys there, I would prefer it if they liked my games.

But it's not as big of a deal as other other leagues, I would prefer my favor, were the same. So I'm fine. Like if and I kind of like it sometimes when it's not like a major team, if like, my brother or Sasha, they'll cheer for one team. So then I'll just cheer for the other because I like that. They're, it's important that there be fans for every single team or then again, there's no sports, you know, like the Harlem Globetrotters. They always play one team. I can't remember what they're called. But they always have lost this team. Right? It's a two person is a two team leap. And it's not a really, it's not a real sport. It's just a gimmick, right? We can't have any back in the day I probably wanted everyone to be a Packers fan. Now I realize you need to have differences in sports. In order to have a sport

I: have you ever had like, gotten into arguments with other teams fans? Or what are those arguments mostly about and stuff like that? In the past?

R: In the past, probably, yeah. I personally argue the most about sports with would be my brother. And there's something I just learned that Freud had this concept of like, there's like narcissism and like the minor differences are like you agree on everything. And so you glob on to those, those two things you don't agree on? So Caleb and I, we were basically the same people we have when it comes to beliefs like we have completely different personalities, but he, you know, we go yeah, we love the Packers. Yeah, we like this guy. This guy, this guy, this guy. Yeah, we think he should be doing this. And then we get to one minor thing where like, counsel pose the picture and ending early and then kill Look does last time we had a major, major major fight and alcohol gonna help. But like he he was he was complaining that we should let the starting pitcher go one inning later and I'm like, No, that was fine. And then we just, it just blew up. It's like, usually we don't have that. That's like a whole different thing where it's like brothers. I don't know the last time I've had a real argument. Like I'll debate when you're talking about Yes, in Michigan, there's a bunch of lions fans so they're not gonna there's so beaten down and they have nothing really to talk about. When I complain about Rogers, so like, what are you complaining about? you're complaining about one of the greatest quarterbacks that ever played. Yeah. Okay. Oh, so what?

I: What words or images come to mind when you think about your the Packers

R: Cheese.

I: Oh my god. Everyone says the cheese

R: when I was a kid

had this thing where it's like a funny funny cuz it's like I've had so many memories with the Packers I'm now getting tons of them rushing through their like games and where you are. I just I was just giving devotions last week for my school where I had to do the preacher and I mentioned one when it came to prayer and the power of prayer because I remember when 2003 the Packers needed the Vikings to lose the last game of the season. The Packers needed the packers and they weren't they the Vikings were good and they needed to lose to the cardinals. Who suck. And I just remember, just praying and praying and praying, please, please, please, please, please. I Little did I know that it's irrelevant to pray for a sports team because everyone prays for sports teams is zero. And that was kind of a point of my devotion. You got to pray for bigger things. He, I prayed, I was crying, I was crying. Every commercial break, I'd run to my room, just cry, pray to God. And with three seconds left of actually, time expired, this crappy quarterback for the Cardinals, he threw it into the end zone, and a guy caught it and he got pushed out of bounds. Back in those days. If he got pushed out of bounds, it counted as a catch. Nowadays, it doesn't count as catch and they changed it because of this play. And so they lose even though the guys weren't in balance. He had caught it but was pushed out. So the Packers made the playoffs. So that's one memory I come up with. But when I was a kid, we went to I don't know if they still have it, but there's the own The center right next to Lambeau Field, and they will sometimes turn that into the packer experience. So as a kid, I went there a few times, where it's like, you play all these cool football games, you try to catch you, you do the Lambo leap, you try to see if you can do the Lambo even see how high you can jump. It was so cool as a kid. So that's something that comes to mind just now just like green, green and gold Packers

I: And if like your team was a person, how would you describe the character of the person?

R: I think I would describe it as sometimes maybe I'll describe it as like Weber was I think Brett Farve is the Green Bay Packers where he's this old cool guy. They have made a great impact. So I don't know. That's a good question. Because something about referencing this old guy who's carrying on this tradition, but still has this passion, because the Packers This is old story franchise, but we still have the most passion. But then you'd also kind of like, what's the casual what's gone? The regular Wisconsin, Sam, he's probably this heavyset big guy. But that's just the Green Bay Packers. Yeah, I'd probably say some are like Vince Lombardi or something like that. Yeah. Somebody who's old and tough. story. I guess we think the bears have a different type of tough were they're known for their defense. The packers are just known for a tough offense historically, were until Rogers came along, but we've never known I think verifies the preference so far.

I: Oh, do you? Oh, do players have an effect on your desire to watch a game? Oh, I guess we covered that like,

R: kind of with Rogers but also watch it but then if there are players like I who is a player that I really wanted to watch Derrick Henry play. I was glad I got to see him play for money back for the time. That's impressive. Patrick mahomes is kind of fun to see. Just Yeah. But it's usually like awesome says I really liked the Kansas City offense. The way the Titans were. And just watching the Patriots play is always fun just because there's so much article.

I: Do you watch football games even when your team is having a losing Season.

R: Yeah.

I: And why is that? What's like the motivation when, when they're letting you down every game of the season.

R: Well, there's a thing with football, there's only 16 games on the fast pacing might be able to be close. And again, it's not like when you go on 16 you're being blown out every single day. But even then, it's like a three hour thing, watch your team and see if they do better. Baseball is hard. I mean, a 2016. The brewers had one there worst seasons ever, because they're trying to rebuild and get young draft picks and trade everyone who is and that's hard to watch 162 games, when you know they're gonna lose 110 of them. But football 16 games is fine. And you might be able to win one when you win that one like when Brett Hundley won that game against the Browns when like that was fun and you're on the edge of your seat. Still because you Just want to see marginal improvement. If you're like if you're a real fan who just wants to see and it's still fun. Suppose the Packers as long as the people are doing it, I'd rather lose the right. Lose with some sort of respect. When, like this last season, we want a lot of games and I thought we were horrible. It was probably more fun to watch that. I shouldn't say that. But there wasn't a whole lot of fun watching this season. It was frustrating.

I: Would you still like do you think that it is like, a sign of like people not being loyal if they stop watching if their team is losing or maybe it's just like

R: yes. But I can't blame a lions fan for not watching or a Browns fan or at the same time. So you're probably not if you're not watching the games are falling at least, like baseball is different, because you're not gonna want. No one has time to watch every single baseball game. And once you accept that, that's when you can become a real baseball fan, because that's sustainable. If you're not watching at least most of the games that you can watch, I don't know if you really watch it again. So that's something bandwagon fans do. If you're still watching football games, but you're watching another team.

I: Do you watch ads during games? Or do you think they take away from watching experience?

R: I think they add something I don't know. My wife taught me this awesome trick that I never knew. And now my family's like what's going on? But we just mute the ads. Which is great. So then we better have time to talk. And now we can listen. And now my parents are like, Why? What's going on? Like they just need the noise. I think that's a very American thing. Is that kind of background music?

I: Do you think there are people who actually can enjoy the ads and pay attention to them and like

R: there's something about football with the Super Bowl is that people actually watch the thing for the ads even though the ads are still crap. So that's another interesting like, like I teach American history. And I, there are a lot of things about America that can seem negative, or you can put it as like a point of pride. And it's just like, there's no such thing Americans do because we see like commercials. We use them as entertainment. We try to make our commercials as entertaining as possible. Like Obviously, I'm not crazy about materialism. But it's not always liking ads doesn't necessarily mean you're a materialist. You're just

I: Have you ever like bought something because you saw an ad?

R: I'm sure. Probably all the time probably daily.

Something I go, maybe it's not even that thing. But if I see like a beer commercial, I go like, I kind of need some beer. I'll grab grab my beer, or like a restaurant, or I guess anything. I guess it depends. I've never bought a car because of the car and because part of me wonders why they do that. But most people aren't in the market for a brand new car.

I: Oh, so I already asked you about watching a game but would you buy tickets if your team was having a bad season?

R: Oh, if I could afford it

could afford to watch a Packers fan the Packers game as if they were doing poorly. And then the Brewers, that's the thing. When you lose, you're still gonna have like Sasha and I, I guess we're still good last year, but we watched some blow up games. And it was still some of the most fun I have at game was one session I wanted this reds game just got destroyed. And it was still fun. Just because it got almost funny just to see because we're going through a really rough stretch that year, or that time when the Brewers just kind of became a thing of the song. Football. Yeah. I'm very, very comfortable with dealing with losing teams.

I: Do you think like star players matter and they drive fans to go to games, more

R: In football I don't think so. Not nearly, not nearly as much as basketball. I think star players or star players in the NFL, because like Odell Beckham Jr. I guess, I guess a wide receiver can be flashy. But I think something that like, I mean, they wear helmets. So you can't even really see them. You know, like you don't you kind of just know them from their jerseys and their position. And so I really think football is a very interchangeable thing people say oh, you can't replace a quarterback but I think that's changed. With the more we spread it out, the more friendly you are towards anyone who can throw a ball and then you're going to I think you again i don't i don't see anybody really going to a full bargain, spending all that money just because they want to see one player. Mm hmm. Basketball that makes sense. Like the NBA like the box. Box tickets have gone way up because have yawns identical but it was not a superstar. And whenever LeBron James is in town in Milwaukee, that is a sold out game. But in baseball, for example, they do it based on the teams so Chicago, cubs, there's huge this like the cubs are in town or the Yankees. Not necessarily because there's one player people want to see is because it's this brand. So I think the Patriots are in town. I don't think people are going to see Tom Brady. They're coming to see Bill Belicheck and the team.

Because there's the Patriots or the Cowboys. Same thing. No one's going there to see Dak Prescott or his ego yet they're there to see the Cowboys.

I: So, so you would say so you would say that like a team. The football team is like their own brand.

R: Yeah, I would say some of them. You might flip on the TV to watch the Zeke Elliott play. And fantasy football is kind of done a lot to make the star big but just just to watch TV for a little fantasy football team. Mm hmm

I: what are some things you would want would like to change about your team currently that would make you more like attached to them are more loyal?

R: I would I would trade for Haha, I can't remember who that was. Oh, Marcus. Mariota

Mariota could do something a bit cheap. Give him a try. Trade Rogers Cuz we have no receivers. Do we have no money to pay receivers? We have no o line Bulaga is he retiring? Bulaga I think he's retired.

I: I think he's in free agency.

R: Okay, so maybe we should but he's always hurt. He's constantly hurt what can we do to shore up any of this? We paid all our money we're giving our mattress $50 million.

I'm still gonna watch it.

I was not thrilled about the coaching. Like LeFluer. I'm starting to like a bit more. I would like a more if we got rid of Rogers because I just I don't see how that fits. Everyone was saying, oh, because Sean McVeigh is a young coach. We need a young coach. Like Andy Reid, I get that we won't be able to get Andy Reid and you restarted with the Packers. He's the youngest coach. There is when it comes to you. plays play calling and being on the cutting edge of offense. He's one of the oldest. So it's tough to say we need a young guy.

I:Oh, ah, why would you keep watching even though your team is eliminated from the playoffs?

R: There's always something. There's always something because it's better to win a game.

Unless you like the Lions where it's like, oh, let's just not win again so we could get a high draft pick. For me. It's such a crapshoot. We're like the box. They got Yanis with like the 15th pick in the draft like you can get somebody who's not in the first round. Everyone else on that draft I think sorry. I can't remember who's the first round. Yeah, so it's just the watch the game especially for the factory. For the Packers in football in general, it's just because there's only 16 games. So who cares? Just watch the game because it's more fun to watch football than anything else you're going to do on a Sunday afternoon. But for baseball, that's different in this unique, like, if the Brewers are horrible, that's when they start trading all their players. And you say, well, what's the point of watching that? Well, then maybe you don't watch it every day. But you want to see all the guys they have from the minor leagues going up to the major leagues, and seeing how they're going to perform because that's the future. You got to take a look at the future. Say, this young guy. He's struggling right now, but he's supposed to be really good. Let's take a look at him. So then you're cheering for him to improve? Yeah, next year will be better. So

I: what are some of your favorite things about being a football fan?

R: I love the history of the NFL. Did you ever watch session I watched this Peyton's places thing is really cool. And I'm crazy. I love like the NFL films music again. It's like the music is so competitive baseball. It's got this like, you feel like you're a gladiator or you're watching gladiators baseball's like this. The question was, how do I feel my watch, you

I: know, like, what are your favorite things about being or how you feel?

R: Yeah, I guess it is how I feel. It's, it's just a moment and being able to let the play off and things like that. Living, you're watching human beings make some of the biggest decisions in their lives. And it all rests on their shoulders. You see how that I don't know if you saw who was a detective against the bills and their playoff game. And Josh Allen. Yeah, these crazy decisions just go your backwards and stuff. And that's so cool. And it's like you can be judgmental towards them. But it's just like it's so cool what stress does to the human mind?

Like I'm fine with seeing. And you're seeing this cool mixture of young and old you have guys on the way out guys on the way guys trying to prove themselves to the superstars. You have these coaches. There's so many different storylines that are really cool that it's an it's not scripted. And I think that's the coolest thing where it's like, you can watch a Netflix show, but you know, that is all planned and that kind of reduce The randomness, the randomness and the unpredictability of life. That's what sports is in reality TV that's scripted, and it's kind of boring. No matter what they do is like, Oh, this is a cool idea. But that's not sustainable for hundreds of years. But sports is because it plays on this constant need, or a constant desire to see people struggle, fail and succeed. You never know what's gonna happen next. And I think there's something cool about something cool about football, could also be just the fact that the ball shape the way it's shaped, because you literally have no idea how the ball is going about, like, in his one way, and then it's, it's like the essence of unpredictability is the shape of the football, where it hits you have no idea where it's gonna go. So that's cool. Yeah.

I: There are just a couple more questions left, we're almost done

R: I have nothing to do for weeks

I: So I hear that like you like the tradition of it, and stuff like that. That's really cool. That's a cool it's But I also wanted to ask like, if you because you mentioned that a couple times, but now that you're older, do you buy any t merchandise? And if not, how else do you show support towards your team and like

R: I have constantly been wanting, like even just going. I've talked to Sasha about this, just getting like Chinese jerseys. I get it, that would be exactly what my team would want me to do. But it's just I don't know when I'd have enough money to say I'm just going to spend $120 on a piece of clothing. That's not like a suit that I'm forced to buy. Even a suit. Why do I assume I need to buy a shirt? It looks cooler. I always look more like one of the people but um yeah, I I would just spending money on tickets to games as well. Yeah, I probably am not the biggest revenue driver that my sports teams are gonna have.

Well, I mean, they have other people to do that too. And I guess the question was also like, so like, maybe not about buying merchandise that they have licensed or like stuff like that, but like showing it like going outside in the packer shirt, like going in public showing support for your team that way maybe like,

Yeah, and I mean, I feel like I'm, I'm a very good missionary for the Milwaukee Brewers. And I the packers are more known, especially in this area. But baseball has a huge chance to kind of riff but reincarnate Well, no one like none of the kids I teach maybe one out of every 20 pay attention to baseball at all. Now, if I talk about football, most people raise their hands. Always say have a favorite.

So when I get to go and say, yeah, Miller Park is like the most fun thing. It's a fun environment. They're like, they're not even lovable losers. They stay competitive, but they don't have money. And in baseball, there's no salary cap. So the Yankees can buy their team every year. The brewers have to grow and make decisions and do math to say, Okay, this guy is way cheaper, and he could probably do the same thing. We could buy two or three of them for the price of this guy who's overpriced. So that's a cool aspect of kids are ever gonna watch baseball again on their own free will. But yeah, and I'll talk about the Packers too, but I haven't been the best missionary about the Packers recently because it's always about me. Calling out Rodgers

I don't know I was thinking and like to me the fact that do you think the ownership of the team can reflect on them poorly like cool thing about the Packers is that they don't have it would require the entire city of Green Bay to do something really deplorable but like I know that the Clippers their old owner he got in a lot of trouble demonstrating w an interesting thing for you and research like that. I wonder how that affected the team or just the brand. He got forced from now it was a little like shady how he got caught. But he had some black escort who was like his mistress, and he said a lot of racist things like saying, don't we? But he goes like, yeah, don't go bring any black people to my games or something like that was like really, it was all under undercover, but then it got released. And then people are like, dude, you gotta go. And so that hurt the Clippers brand. But then some guy who, who's that one guy who owns Microsoft, but it isn't Bill Gates, some guy there. He bought it out, like a discount. So then he kind of changed the culture there. So I think an owner like the Brewers, owner, mark on anti nausea. I don't even know how he made his money. But he doesn't have a whole ton of it. And so he's got to be really quick. He cares about the Brewers winning when he came into ownership. The brewers never won. And he said, You know what, I don't have a whole lot of money, but this is going to be kind of my baby. And I don't because there are other big owners who have a million things that they're owning. And so they're like, the Brewers, I don't care, whatever. Yeah, it's just one of my investments. Just make sure it's making me money. I don't care. But he's like, I want Milwaukee to have a winning team. And we'll do What it takes for them to win. Even if I have to write a check that I can't really feasibly do that. Give it a try. So, I do think an owner like Jerry Jones and the and the Cowboys craft. It does have especially as the reputation I guess if you're looking for new fans, you go Yeah, well, who's a who's an owner that everyone, the owners, the Glazers, they own the Buccaneers, and they've owned them for like 20 years. And everyone hates them. They say they're the cheapest people don't really care about the team, but they're still the owners of the Buccaneers. So that would be a really hard sell for you to say, as it's hard enough. Let's try to be on the other side. And I mean, they're like right across from each other Jacksonville, their owner, I can't remember what his name is. That's what's it is almost a city con but he's the mayor of he's like a radian guy was seek. And he's decided to really cash in on England. And so the Jaguars every single year are playing him. So now he has a whole if he could catch him on the entire nation are all great, great. Well, then he just pumped up because Jack's Jacksonville market is just a small screen back. But he said, I got the money, let's just play in England. So I think the owner can do a lot in order to create fans. Mm hmm.

I: And so the last question is, are there teams that you particularly dislike, and why?

R:

Yes. The Chicago Cubs because they're from Chicago.

My when I was my birthday, my mom posted a video one of my favorite shirts as a kid was a Chicago Cubs shirt. Because maybe I like talk a lot.

But I hate the Cubs and Cubs fans are the worst like they come up. There's an interesting dynamic, but they call Miller Park where the Brewers play Wrigley Field north. The cubs are in Chicago, which itself a Milwaukee and they play at Wrigley Field. And so they just, they're tons of Chicago fans because Chicago is a huge market, and they all come up to Miller Park. And so it's a situation where half the crowd is half of the crabs, crabs, Cubs fans, and they just

Chicago fans in general I don't like

the Yankees. I guess I don't care about the Yankees because they're in the American League. And the only reason I would care about them is if we played them in the World Series. Again, I used to hate the Vikings more than any other team. But there's something about Minnesota that I love and I've become very close. And I enjoy Minnesota fans a lot more than I enjoy bears fans. So don't hate them as much anymore. hated the bowls. When I follow basketball closer.

I know there's gonna be a team I just really, really really don't know a huge fan of.

Well, that's just a player. Yeah, where they don't like the Dodgers, because they had this guy who was just horrible. couldn't stand them. But I'm trying to think does it good. I don't hate the Cowboys, pregnant cheer for the Cowboys. Because now they have Mike McCarthy. I'll cheer for them. Like, in a way, you know, like the same way not as my second favorite team or anything, but I don't. I've been teams that I hate their players I hate and so then I'll hate the team as long as they're on that. That's interesting. That could be something where it's like, maybe it's cuz I'm so true. Less when it comes to sports that I think that these big name guys who try to make themselves like Antonio browns. I liked Antonio brown before he lost, he clearly has some sort of mental illness. But do you see those videos of him like, cursing at the cops and his kids and stuff? Yeah. His wife is what whoever she is, is like he's just cussing. But like, a lot of people go I'm an Antonio browns and probably not after that. But like, I'm just like in basketball particularly, there's some like bad guys are like really selfish people that everyone likes them. I just really don't like them because they're making it about themselves, and not the team or the sport in general. And like, I get that. And that's something me my brother kind of disagree with to where he's more into like, saying, oh, let the kids have fun. That's one thing in baseball where and Sasha gets me to where I every time Every time somebody gets a tackle, they could have stopped somebody they could have been a five yard game so neither side really wins. And you'll see both people celebrating people people doing a dance because there's a five yard play. People are constantly dancing and running around you get a sack and then you must tire yourself out like the dairy is Smith. You run sprints like 20 yards to do a dance and he has to sprint back and I just like, like I love scenario. Smith was like,

I maybe I'm getting to crotchety old.

I:Yeah, thank you. That was very cool. Thank you for that interview. I'm gonna stop recording now.

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