Социальная адаптация и интеграция мигрантов

Is this more rare now than when you first came to Korea 5 years ago?

Sure! Sure! Because the Korean system regarding the foreigners'' registration, IDs, their number …when I first came to Korea we were not able, for example, to put our English names on them or our middle names, only short. So all the Korea system…anyway they are not able to understand or recognize our names on the ID registration cards. But now things have changes because of the number of foreigners. Some of them I haven't experienced, but system itself, I think, it's much better, so we received improvements about that.

And what usually your reaction is in this kind of situations?

Usually I would explain that I'm not the first one, this has been done and I'm sure you can do it. And that like make them more confident, that is actually good, so…they will be able to do it. I really like to explain them “oh, I've done that before, it's not the first time”, I try to persuade them. But if I get more of a rejection I just try to go somewhere else.

And how about situations when someone tries to trick you, about price or something? Have you experienced this and what was your reaction?

I think, yeah, I think a couple of times when I tried to buy used phones for other foreigners…they just came to Korea and they wanted a phone, so tried to help them to buy it from the used phones market. And the seller already saw that a group of foreigners tried to buy something and he would give us a very high price. Then I would go like “No, no, this is not my first time” and he said “oh, then I'm not selling”. Sort of that. All them would be like “we have this and this” and tried to trick us with higher prices. It is not that common as other countries, so I wouldn't really say that this is a nature in Korea: it's very rare. It's only within the...about used phones, or people who are trying to sell traditional and expensive artifacts of Korea, culture…Except those I cannot say it's common that much. I don't think it's a problem.

Maybe you can say like this, because you already have experience, but how about before when you encountered for the first time? What do you do?

I would…usually I would pay if I don't have the options. And I would pay this extra or do this extra work just because I cannot…I don't have this medium of communication with them. Because usually this is happening with people who don't speak Korean of course. So the communication medium is not there. It's frustration but it's just better to go on with it. This is usually how I experienced this, how I do it.

Okay. Let's move on to the other topic. Have you ever tried to initiate new acquaintances with Korean people by yourself?

That's very easy. Usually… I don't know, in Europe or somewhere else it's very common, but at least it's not abnormal thing to approach strangers and start to chat. And then from that chat you can exchange numbers or like “See you later”. But here it's not that much. Most people know each other through a common medium, either there are in the same class or in the same project or friends of friends. It's really rare to see people to talk to each other like strangers on the street, really rare. So for me… I've seen this, so I knew this and I didn't really approach that much. But I think I was approached being foreigner. I was being approached like “Oh, where are you from?” and that's of course started a conversation, at some point they wanted to help me. So I saw that way of starting friendship in Korea is though these people, at the beginning at least. So myself… just to approach someone and I'm not in a group, I don't have someone or something in common with that and just to start a chat - I don't think I've done that. Maybe only once, I don't really remember. I don't think I've done that.

Anyway it's not so common here…

Yeah, it's not so common.

So, okay. Let's consider a situation where you're being approached by other people. Usually what the atmosphere between you guys is: is it friendly from the beginning or is it intense first?

Oh, I think when they approach they are looking very shy and smiling, so I though that would remove any intensity because, well, you can't be intense and shy at the same time. So they usually approach like very shy and curious and once we're asking a question we feel like “okay, they can speak a little bit of English”. They would be a little tensed at the beginning because we are unable to speak Korean. Then we would…the moment they start to speak with us there would be more questions and they would be like “they can understand Korean, which is nice”, because now I have someone with whom I can speak to in Korean right now. And usually the conversation just goes smoothly, just simple things about like where we are from and what we are doing here in Korea. Usually after that we just stop at this point and the conversation just doesn't go beyond, and they go back to shy and curious and say “goodbye”. This is I think I would say 80% of them. If they encounter you on the street they would stop like this.

And what language do you usually use? I think for the first time it was English, right?

Yes, it still is. I think that is happening…it wouldn't happen like in Seoul, in the middle of the city or in the tourist area, but it would happen like in the universities, campuses or somewhere where are not so many foreigners. Especially now, it's not that common to have…to do for Korean people: just approach and talk to you like that. Because there are much more foreigners. But I think on the students' campuses other students can be like “oh, we are at the same university!”, so it's not so difficult to approach these foreigners and ask where they are from and make friends. So things are really… especially you know regarding the research about the society, it's more a less stable, but here it's so fast-changing. I can see the changes that happened for 5 years - it's so different!

Can you approximately measure the percentage of your Korean friends among all of your friends?

(thinking) Now, at the moment?

Yes, now.

At the moment I would say…70% are Koreans.

Did you gain a lot of friends for these 5 years?

Yes.

Okay. What difficulties you suppose the most significant that you've experienced so far in Korea?

(thinking) I think it's just changing of everything in my life… it started as food: I didn't accept the food, I was not able to eat the Korean food at all for 6 months or more. That was really tough: not being able to the common food. This was a big challenge at the beginning. But then at some point I just gave the taste of the food, I was like “okay, food now, that is delicious food” and just ate it, because I wanted to continue my life without spending so much time and money to just eat. I was just thinking about that as food. And the moment I've done that I got used to it and I started to acquire this taste. I thought that at the beginning it's just food. And later it was when I tried to build deeper relationships, that was very frustrating, because everybody…even I thought they are my friends they would be more…they want to know me deep but wouldn't open up about their own selves that much. So I feel like it's not connecting at the both sides and it's frustrating to be 1 year in Korea and still not have any close friends. Korean I mean. This was another challenge for me. And last challenge for me right now is this kind of conflict in my head between what they are doing: should I try to explain that this would be better or should I just leave it. It's more of a discussion within: should I leave things the same as they are or should I change them and make conflicts and confrontations. But I think it's not that serious as the first ones.

And have you succeeded to overcome them in your opinion?

The food one - absolutely. And the relationship thing…I think I did. I think that I'm not fully satisfied I assured that I have overcome those people, because I have friends, Korean friends who discuss with me their private life and I discuss with them my private life and I'm very close with them even we don't meet every month. My best friend is Korean. So I think yes, I have overcome this.

Okay. Now we are moving on to the last topic. Do you want to stay in Korea on a permanent basis?

I don't mind. I don't have a plan where but as long as…because I'm very active with breathing more about Korea. When I walk on the street I still don't think it's for granted that I'm just living here. So I'm always looking around seeing how people behave and the different culture. The country is changing so fast. And I'm in love with politics, Korean politics, I'm really fond of how complex it is. I don't understand that much of it, but I'm still very curious about the country. You know, there are so many things that I've overcome so now it became more simple because of I've been here for 5 years, but there are still way more things I'm curious about. So that's one more reason why I don't mind staying here permanently, at least right now, when I'm thinking about it.

Okay. Actually we didn't talk about your job so much yet. So can you tell me what is the atmosphere between you and your coworkers or your bosses at your workplace?

I think…okay, so for me I'm working with a group of people, I like the environment, I like the intercommunication between members and everything, so I don't have problems with that. But because I'm not fully myself at work in a way that…when you are at the last year of university the most concerns of all Koreans is how to get a job. And because it was always a concern of everybody I made it as a challenge to myself. Not to them, to myself. Everybody see that it is almost impossible thing and only very few people can join big conglomerates in Korea such as SK company. So I was like “Okay, I will aim for that and I will prove to them that you don't need just grades, just good grades and exams to get there”. You can do it though a different…a “snake” style, around the corner and to get there. So I just aimed for that, I wanted to get there because all the Koreans want to get there and I wanted to prove to Koreans that I can also actually do it, even though I didn't get the same education as they did, or I didn't go to the academy all the time for studying extra English or extra math or extra whatever. So it was kind of a challenge for me I tried to join the company as a trainee, from the very beginning. I joined with the other Koreans with the same exams, with the same entry. All of us have to train for 3 months, corporate culture training. It looked little like a reality show, when they kicked people out and watched who will stay at the end. There is another way: for example some foreigners in Korea would do just like “oh, I want to work in Korea” and they would join as foreigners, they would use their skill of multilanguage and they would join. But I wanted to join just like Koreans. So people have these expectations of me to behave like one. So at the beginning I was behaving exactly like Koreans: except how I look it was 100% acting and behaving exactly like them. And that helped me to get very huge trust from my coworkers, because this is very new to Korea to receive foreigners as entry level trainees, foreigners who speak Korean. So for them I was like “okay, you're Korean, so we will treat you just like Koreans”, and I'm acting…I'm not like raising my card at all at work. At work I really rarely raise my “foreign card”. So because of that I think I'm okay at work, I enjoy this work much, but at the same time I'm not myself fully. But for me, because it's the beginning of my career…I would just take it in for a while, as long as trying to get experience. And it's not that bad, I wouldn't say it's bad that I'm like surviving every day, it's fine.

As I know this is really big issue for Korean people to get a job, so how did you manage to get one?

After I finished university I checked for the few big conglomerates in Korea: Samsung, SK, LG - those big companies. And I looked at those recruiting requirements and how they hire, so I saw that they put a big emphasis on the English language. So applied for all the main exams: TOPIK, TOEIC, TOEIC Speaking, all of these. And I did them all, I got the grades from those exams. And then I started applying though these websites. The process is very long and vary, so I tried to speak things up by finding on the Internet the Human Resource departments responsible for people and send them e-mail that…pretending that I don't know how to apply. So once I get a response from them I was like just asking them for a meeting to discuss a bit about the company. If a Korean would do that they would not reply, because they know that these Koreans are supposed to know hoe to get this information. So I honestly did of course use my “foreign card” by trying to pretend that I don't know how to do and be curious about the company, so they would be like “oh, you're curious about our company? Okay, I'll meet you for a while, 5 minutes or 10”, and they would talk to me about it. So they would remember me. So I would apply with other Koreans and wait for the process, and when the interviewer comes there I would have the chance of things different. I think that helped, because they see me as an equal to Koreans: being graduated from Korean university and speaking Korean. So they don't see me less than a Korean. But at the same time they see that I'm different. You know like when these big companies hire 100 or 200 at one time, there are so many applicants, more than 1000. So at the beginning it's not actually the skills you have, it's more like how you stand out. As long as you're different it's easier to get picked up, because you're being picked out from thousands and you're easily to be remembered by the interviewers. So I continued with the same procedure and exams as everyone else. I didn't fail one because of this advantage I have, no. I think passed all of them just like Koreans. This is how I get. I don't think it's as difficult as Koreans say it is, but I think most of the students they don't get…in Korea if you're studying engineering usually from the middle school you're concentrating so much on physics, math and stuff, that you don't really study about human resources or managements, or ideas that… It's very difficult to change your perspective, because you don't have knowledge of other perspectives. I'm fortunate to have different culture and diverse background, and I was already working for a while. So when I was approaching for a job I was always thinking what these guys would think of me, why would the human resources pick me up. And I think this is what is missing among all the young Koreans, that's why they think of it so difficult: because they are all competing to look exactly the same. It's very difficult for HR to pick up some skills, it's not just that obvious. And it's just my opinion.

Have you ever had any conflicts at work?

I think what about management then the company is still not used to have foreigners, especially at the entry level. So they still don't know how to do our text, reforms, pensions, calculations. They still don't know how to classify us, what we are (laughing). But this is just a new thing for the company. This is from the management side. In case with coworkers' relationships…I think at the beginning the thing is about having like who you are and what your limitation is. An example for that: my biggest I think conflict I had was with a senior from the other team, who would come to my team and talk to my coworkers in Korean thinking that I don't speak “high” Korean and only very-very basic Korean. And he would talk about me in a very low form. This is disrespectful, but more like a teacher would talk about a student. I felt it was descending me, like “why is he working here?”. My coworkers, they know that I can speak Korean so they would be defending me, they would really defending me, but at some point he was very open about his opinion when he knew that I speak Korean. And he was loud because he is a senior and I didn't like it: when he speaks up it looks like I'm not working. For example, he would be coming and like “oh, what are you doing? Are you playing, right?”. He was joking, but I saw it that people heard him and some people might believe him. Because it's easy: I'm not Korean, I'm a foreigner, they could be like “we don't know how foreigners work, so he really might be playing”. I really didn't want that kind of “sticker”, so I couldn't take it. And at some point I just went to him, one on one, and I was like “you know how you did this and that? So people started talking about how I'm not working”. I started to have this confrontation about “what you did was wrong” and he was very shocked and was like “really? You really get off because of that?”. And after that he stopped coming to my team at all. I think I wouldn't have it if I'm not a foreigner, because... I mean I wouldn't confront him if I'm not a foreigner. So this one of the biggest, but I think more it's about workplace or study place in Korea - it's more of a unity, and people here are all like members together, and so the personal space is very small. So that kind of mind cause conflicts sometimes.

My last question then: what factors can make you leave the country?

Okay, I would say…factors from Korea itself? Well, factors from outside Korea would be like if I find a better job in Europe I would just leave there right away. But if from Korea itself, I think…mainly it's the difficulties with visa, so if think I have more problems with visa - I would leave the country. I didn't think about it actually (laughing). What would make me leave Korea… I don't know, maybe at one point I would stop having this interest or if I face kind of threats…if I would feel a little bit of pressure that I'm not welcomed here I might actually leave. That would be a reason for me. You know, even though I'm not really a speaker in Korea, I'm not, how to say, doing any speeches or interviews, but I feel like I will always be able to do so. You know, even if you don't use it, you still have it. And if that right is taken from me even though I'm not using it that much I wouldn't be staying here anymore. One of the reasons for me to live in Korea compare to Saudi Arabia is freedom of speech.

Well, thank you very much! I'm very satisfied with our interview!

Yes, me too! (laughing) Thank you very much too.

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